Alec Baldwin?

FormerFatOL

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If it was you or me mishandling a firearm in every day life we'd be in jail, and rightfully so. However, I believe movie sets have very strict protocol and union rules on how firearms are handled. A professional armorer typically handles and preps the weapons and I don't think actors are allowed to mess with them at all. I have no idea if that's the case with this indie film in NM, but I'm guessing Baldwin has no personal liability on this.
 


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If it was you or me mishandling a firearm in every day life we'd be in jail, and rightfully so. However, I believe movie sets have very strict protocol and union rules on how firearms are handled. A professional armorer typically handles and preps the weapons and I don't think actors are allowed to mess with them at all. I have no idea if that's the case with this indie film in NM, but I'm guessing Baldwin has no personal liability on this.

The union armorer (and much of the crew) walked off the set and they brought in scabs. There’s a labor element to this story. As an executive producer, Baldwin certainly has some culpability here.
 

FormerFatOL

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The union armorer (and much of the crew) walked off the set and they brought in scabs. There’s a labor element to this story. As an executive producer, Baldwin certainly has some culpability here.

No question he has potential culpability if he's the boss. Probably not as an actor.
 

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I think I have pretty much proven here over time that Trump isn't my cup of tea, but Baldwin's Trump wasn't funny. It wasn't satire, it was ridicule. Which can be funny, but there needs to be a layer of truth telling to sustain it.

It was funny the first time. And then it continued and was like the rest of SNL. Not very good or clever.
 


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If it was you or me mishandling a firearm in every day life we'd be in jail, and rightfully so. However, I believe movie sets have very strict protocol and union rules on how firearms are handled. A professional armorer typically handles and preps the weapons and I don't think actors are allowed to mess with them at all. I have no idea if that's the case with this indie film in NM, but I'm guessing Baldwin has no personal liability on this.
The union armorer (and much of the crew) walked off the set and they brought in scabs. There’s a labor element to this story. As an executive producer, Baldwin certainly has some culpability here.

It'll be very interesting to see what happens with this. Considering people left the set due to unsafe conditions....you would have to think some people are culpable. Doesn't explain how a prop gun was that deadly......but clearly there were some major oversights.
 

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It'll be very interesting to see what happens with this. Considering people left the set due to unsafe conditions....you would have to think some people are culpable. Doesn't explain how a prop gun was that deadly......but clearly there were some major oversights.

A prop gun is a gun, nothing special about it. It had a live round in it from earlier target shooting, stupid mistake. Whoever was responsible for the gun is responsible for this accident.
 

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A prop gun is a gun, nothing special about it. It had a live round in it from earlier target shooting, stupid mistake. Whoever was responsible for the gun is responsible for this accident.

Which makes little sense to me. With the technology available these days....how are there not prop guns that cannot fire live ammo?
 

Wally

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Which makes little sense to me. With the technology available these days....how are there not prop guns that cannot fire live ammo?
Won't look real without the smoke etc...
 



balds

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A prop gun is a gun, nothing special about it. It had a live round in it from earlier target shooting, stupid mistake. Whoever was responsible for the gun is responsible for this accident.
So if you give me a gun and tell it's empty, and I shoot and kill somebody with it, I bear zero legal consequence?
 

Wally

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So if you give me a gun and tell it's empty, and I shoot and kill somebody with it, I bear zero legal consequence?
If it's the persons job who told you it's empty, then yes. There are hundreds of analogous situations where its the same.
Common sense isn't so common on the right.
 

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First part (bolded) of the first page I Googled on gun safety/handling a gun:

Assume all guns are loaded all the time.
Never assume a gun is empty. Check to ensure that the gun is unloaded and the chamber empty. If you act like the gun is always loaded, you will treat it with more respect and are less likely to have a negligent discharge. How to check if a handgun is loaded or unloaded:

"Without due caution and circumspection". Did Alec Baldwin exercise due caution and circumspection? That's what it will come down to re: Involuntary Manslaughter.

I'm not sure of the legal consequences for the assistant director or the weapons lady. Certainly they played a role in the killing but didn't directly kill her, as Alec Baldwin did.
 
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Stan

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First part (bolded) of the first page I Googled on gun safety/handling a gun:

Assume all guns are loaded all the time.
Never assume a gun is empty. Check to ensure that the gun is unloaded and the chamber empty. If you act like the gun is always loaded, you will treat it with more respect and are less likely to have a negligent discharge. How to check if a handgun is loaded or unloaded:

"Without due caution and circumspection". Did Alec Baldwin exercise due caution and circumspection? That's what it will come down to re: Involuntary Manslaughter.

I'm not sure of the legal consequences for the assistant director or the weapons lady. Certainly they played a role in the killing but didn't directly kill her, as Alec Baldwin did.

You are trying to push your bias into this story. Your theory puts criminal blame on Rowdy Rowdy Piper taking a chair to the back of Jake the Snake. If Rowdy injures Snake's back from a chair, Snake can't sue Rowdy. They are in entertainment and there are assumed risks. Sorry to disappoint you, but the same in this situation. The criminal liability (if there is any) will be with the person who's job was literally to clear the ammo from the gun.

A lawsuit on the other hand will likely go after the movie studio, potentially Baldwin, and many others. You can get your Baldwin blood there.
 



balds

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You are trying to push your bias into this story. Your theory puts criminal blame on Rowdy Rowdy Piper taking a chair to the back of Jake the Snake. If Rowdy injures Snake's back from a chair, Snake can't sue Rowdy. They are in entertainment and there are assumed risks. Sorry to disappoint you, but the same in this situation. The criminal liability (if there is any) will be with the person who's job was literally to clear the ammo from the gun.

A lawsuit on the other hand will likely go after the movie studio, potentially Baldwin, and many others. You can get your Baldwin blood there.
My only bias is that I wish it never happened. I doubt that getting shot to death was an assumed risk when she signed up for the gig.
 

Stan

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My only bias is that I wish it never happened. I doubt that getting shot to death was an assumed risk when she signed up for the gig.

Yes, and when boxers die in the ring, the other boxer doesn't go to jail for manslaughter. Stop your bias. It's clear. You have common sense. Please use it.
 

Stan

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My only bias is that I wish it never happened. I doubt that getting shot to death was an assumed risk when she signed up for the gig.

Now if the investigation shows Alec Baldwin told the armorer "hey, let's put a couple of real bullets in there and see what triggers" then yes, he should be in jail.
 
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stocker08

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First part (bolded) of the first page I Googled on gun safety/handling a gun:

Assume all guns are loaded all the time.
Never assume a gun is empty. Check to ensure that the gun is unloaded and the chamber empty. If you act like the gun is always loaded, you will treat it with more respect and are less likely to have a negligent discharge. How to check if a handgun is loaded or unloaded:

"Without due caution and circumspection". Did Alec Baldwin exercise due caution and circumspection? That's what it will come down to re: Involuntary Manslaughter.

I'm not sure of the legal consequences for the assistant director or the weapons lady. Certainly they played a role in the killing but didn't directly kill her, as Alec Baldwin did.

You cannot be serious. There are people on set who have the specific responsibility of making sure that these things are safe. The fact that they were using these "prop" guns for target practice earlier simply proves that there was gross negligence by certain people. Furthermore....even if Baldwin had checked the magazine/cylinder.....would he know the difference between live ammunition or a blank?
 

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A lawsuit on the other hand will likely go after the movie studio, potentially Baldwin, and many others. You can get your Baldwin blood there.
Yeah, as executive producer Baldwin probably has some financial exposure.

Criminal exposure? No.
 

MplsGopher

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As an executive producer, Baldwin certainly has some culpability here.
So he gets fired as EP for the mistake, if he in fact was the one who signed off on shooting to continue and/or made the decision to hire non-union workers.

Zero chance for any criminal charges.


More than likely, it was the people paying for the production, who made/pushed for those choices.
 

MplsGopher

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So if you give me a gun and tell it's empty, and I shoot and kill somebody with it, I bear zero legal consequence?
Fake analogy, is fake.

Did Baldwin take the gun, then go run off the set with it and shoot it at a checkout guy at the 7-11 down the road?
 



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I think I have pretty much proven here over time that Trump isn't my cup of tea, but Baldwin's Trump wasn't funny. It wasn't satire, it was ridicule. Which can be funny, but there needs to be a layer of truth telling to sustain it.
In his defense, it shouldn't be on Baldwin to make it funny. SNL is just not funny so you can't really expect Alec Baldwin to find a way to fix that. Part of it is also what Norm said, you can't really do a good impression if you hate someone.

As far as SNL sucking, I actually don't know how much of it is the liberal/conservative stuff and how much of it is just technology. It used to be that SNL was full of the hottest young comics and comedy writers who got paid peanuts to attach their name to this show. Now, all of those people (who would have been writing for SNL 15 years ago), have podcasts. The vehicle isn't as necessary to launch a career and therefore the lack of talent is striking.

I don't like Jimmy Kimmel's politics, but there have been times he has made me laugh (I haven't watched his show in years). I just really don't believe anyone has laughed at SNL in years. I feel the same about the Daily Show (which was a left leaning show that used to be funny).
 

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So if you give me a gun and tell it's empty, and I shoot and kill somebody with it, I bear zero legal consequence?
Unless I'm missing something with the Alec Baldwin story, you're a missing something here. He didn't just go and point the gun at a random, the person he pointed the gun at knew and consented to Alec Baldwin pointing a gun at them.

I think if two people consent to shooting blanks at each other for a movie and the shooter is handed a gun he was told had blanks or wasn't loaded, I don't really see an avenue for legal culpability for Baldwin. To me, it feels like if you went skydiving, and somehow the bag was packed incorrectly. The person who was the door of plane helps to push you out of the plane when you jump. You could say "so someone pushes a person out of a plane and somebody dies, and that person would face zero legal consequence?"

I'm not going to pretend to know anything about what is standard care on a movie website and I don't know enough about guns to really weigh in on a lot of these, but SaintPaulGuy had a great point - why is there ever a live run? Couldn't they just use complete prop guns and put the sounds in after? It seems really bizarre to me that we are ever still using real guns (with blanks or not).
 


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It used to be that SNL was full of the hottest young comics and comedy writers who got paid peanuts to attach their name to this show.
It if helps, I noticed they brought in James Austin Johnson as the new Trump and Biden. He is definitely a new face in comedy. Really just got popular on social media.

And his impressions are pretty great. I think his Trump is better than Baldwin.

 

MplsGopher

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I think his Trump is better than Baldwin.
Sure it's more accurate, just for the sake of being accurate.


Baldwin Trump, the writing and the delivery were just so damn good.

Like when they had him on the phone to Puerto Rico after the hurricane, and he said "We know you're desperate. Or as the locals say, 'despacito'." :ROFLMAO:

Just 24k gold.
 







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