Adam Rittenberg discusses Gophers' secondary

[BleedGopher]

Elliot from East Richfield, Minn., writes: With Troy Stoudermire being granted another year for the Minnesota Gophers, the Gophers seem to have their cornerbacks pretty set with Stoudermire and Brock Vereen, among others. However, both safety positions are unsettled.Who do you see emerging at safety for the Gophers? James Manuel and maybe Michael Carter? Maybe some newcomers will get a chance to play?

Adam Rittenberg: Elliot, I really think Minnesota will enter spring practice with most of its starting spots open on defense. We heard some good things about Manuel in 2010, when he started three games, but he played strictly as a reserve in 2011, recording 11 tackles in 12 games. Carter was one of Minnesota's top recruits under former coach Tim Brewster, but he hasn't really panned out. There certainly will be opportunities for players to step up in the defensive backfield, as the Gophers must replace Kim Royston's production at safety. Remember that Minnesota also signed three junior college defensive backs. Those guys weren't brought in to sit on the bench.

http://espn.go.com/blog/bigten/post/_/id/43884/big-ten-mailblog-146

Go Gophers!!

 

[everybody knows my name]

We must assume that they are both making mocking the Gophers. Elliott was clearly being sarcastic.

 

[matt]

We must assume that they are both making mocking the Gophers. Elliott was clearly being sarcastic.

I didn't think there was any sarcasm.

 

[zambam]

We must assume that they are both making mocking the Gophers. Elliott was clearly being sarcastic.

This one isn't written in such a way that it feels sarcastic.

 

[calminnfan]

Don't see sarcasm...just an hoenswt question/eval.

 

[Bob_Loblaw]

I don't think there was an sarcasm.

One thing, where is East Richfield? Maybe i'm just a nube when it comes to Richfield, but do people really talk about being from West or East Richfield? I know it's not it's own city (ala South Saint Paul or West Saint Paul, etc.).

It's kind of a nothingless answer though. I don't expect Rittenberg to be an expert on the Gopher secondary, so i'm not ripping him. But he just is essentially regurgitating names he has heard before. If Stoud is healthy, his spot is absolutely his to lose.

 

[Sportsfan24]

I don't expect Rittenberg to be an expert on the Gopher secondary, so i'm not ripping him. But he just is essentially regurgitating names he has heard before. If Stoud is healthy, his spot is absolutely his to lose.

Bingo!

Yet these are the same guys that determine preseason and post season awards (yes I'm still pissed..lol) and ultimately guys livelihood (they won't admit it but NFL scouts use preseason awards/publicity as a jumping off point to start their evaluation.)

 

[everybody knows my name]

I didn't think there was any sarcasm.

I didn't either. I just couldn't resist.

 

[emann]

I don't think there was an sarcasm.

One thing, where is East Richfield? Maybe i'm just a nube when it comes to Richfield, but do people really talk about being from West or East Richfield? I know it's not it's own city (ala South Saint Paul or West Saint Paul, etc.).

It's a joke. Back in the 70s when Richfield was the biggest school in the state, they had two junior highs and it was a big deal to claim which side you were on. It was something that people from each side will needle each other with, but since the entire city is seven miles total, there really isn't much difference. It's kind of the reverse of when people say they are from "Scenic West Bloomington." I don't think the kids today even know of any difference since they no longer have separate Little Leagues or anything, but back even in the 80s and 90s, people would jokingly claim one side or the other.

I asked the question because outside of Manuel -- and it's not like he played all that great, but he's at least a person who played a few snaps -- does anyone know who is going to play safety this year? MV and I talked about it last week and he thought the same thing pretty much, that one spot it pretty much Manuel's job to lose. Even still, the FS and SS positions should be ones to watch this spring.

 

[GophersInIowa]

Bingo!

Yet these are the same guys that determine preseason and post season awards (yes I'm still pissed..lol) and ultimately guys livelihood (they won't admit it but NFL scouts use preseason awards/publicity as a jumping off point to start their evaluation.)

Denard Robinson was voted 2nd team All-Big Ten this year by the media. That's all we need to know about the media's "ability" to determine who deserves these awards.

 

[Nokomis]

One thing, where is East Richfield? Maybe i'm just a nube when it comes to Richfield, but do people really talk about being from West or East Richfield? I know it's not it's own city (ala South Saint Paul or West Saint Paul, etc.).

I think he's writing from Mall of America.

 

[Bob_Loblaw]

It's a joke. Back in the 70s when Richfield was the biggest school in the state, they had two junior highs and it was a big deal to claim which side you were on. It was something that people from each side will needle each other with, but since the entire city is seven miles total, there really isn't much difference. It's kind of the reverse of when people say they are from "Scenic West Bloomington." I don't think the kids today even know of any difference since they no longer have separate Little Leagues or anything, but back even in the 80s and 90s, people would jokingly claim one side or the other.

I asked the question because outside of Manuel -- and it's not like he played all that great, but he's at least a person who played a few snaps -- does anyone know who is going to play safety this year? MV and I talked about it last week and he thought the same thing pretty much, that one spot it pretty much Manuel's job to lose. Even still, the FS and SS positions should be ones to watch this spring.

Ahh right on. I knew there had to be a story behind being from "East Richfield".

Yeah, the safety position is a complete question mark.

I think Balthazar is going to be in the mix at FS. He's a JuCo Guy so I know next to nothing about the guy but I have to think he was brought in to compete for a starting spot this season.

Cedric Thompson looked pretty good in mop up duty last year.

Stevie Montgomery is a guy who RS last year who they seemed pretty high on.

I'd guess going into camp, it will be:

FS: Thompson / Baltazar / Montgomery
SS: Manuel / Levine

There is a chance one of our CBs moves to S as well, i'm not sure who. But yeah, it's a thin position.

 

[KoolAid]

Might be a tough year for us back there. Although I think we're past the days of screaming obscenities at Jamal Harris.

 

[emann]

I'd like to think Thompson moves right in and plays well, but I'd be lying if I said I had a good pulse on what he can really bring to the table. Doogie said last year that Carter should move to safety, maybe that happens. Will be interesting to watch this spring.

 

[Bob_Loblaw]

I'd like to think Thompson moves right in and plays well, but I'd be lying if I said I had a good pulse on what he can really bring to the table. Doogie said last year that Carter should move to safety, maybe that happens. Will be interesting to watch this spring.

Yeah, Thompson is definitely a question mark and it's impossible to have any pulse on him. I hope he can step right in, but I kind of doubt it.

As far as Carter at S, I just don't see it, at all. I don't like the idea of our last line of defense being a guy who was often considered too soft at times for CB. Carter is not a good tackler. If we got annoyed with C. Lewis looking soft, we won't be able to stomach Carter in those situations. I'm not meaning this to rip Carter, he does do some things really well. I think he might be our best man to man cover corner. At the end of last year, he looked really good in those kinds of situations (we'd bring in a bunch of DBs and blitz like crazy (usually leaving Kim and M. Carter in 1-1 man to man situations). I'm not saying it'll happen, but I think there is a better chance you seen Vereen or Stoudermire moved to S than Carter.

I don't know why Doogie suggested that. I hope it had nothing to do with subconsciously comparing him to T. Carter. I'd guess Doogie was just trying to think of a way to get a more talented bench player on the field more. As our 3rd or 4th corner (most likely), Michael Carter will play a lot for us. He is somewhat vital to our success, because he really allows us to blitz more effectively on passing downs.

 

[Sportsfan24]

Yeah, Thompson is definitely a question mark and it's impossible to have any pulse on him. I hope he can step right in, but I kind of doubt it.

As far as Carter at S, I just don't see it, at all. I don't like the idea of our last line of defense being a guy who was often considered too soft at times for CB. Carter is not a good tackler. If we got annoyed with C. Lewis looking soft, we won't be able to stomach Carter in those situations. I'm not meaning this to rip Carter, he does do some things really well. I think he might be our best man to man cover corner. At the end of last year, he looked really good in those kinds of situations (we'd bring in a bunch of DBs and blitz like crazy (usually leaving Kim and M. Carter in 1-1 man to man situations). I'm not saying it'll happen, but I think there is a better chance you seen Vereen or Stoudermire moved to S than Carter.

I don't know why Doogie suggested that. I hope it had nothing to do with subconsciously comparing him to T. Carter. I'd guess Doogie was just trying to think of a way to get a more talented bench player on the field more. As our 3rd or 4th corner (most likely), Michael Carter will play a lot for us. He is somewhat vital to our success, because he really allows us to blitz more effectively on passing downs.

Great points. Here is my two cents.

Total excluding the Juco's because we have no idea what we are getting.

Carter to safety? I don't think he would be much different than the rest of the S's in the conference. If he or anyone else is asked to do what Kim, Shady and Lewis were last season. it won't matter. This team will suck to high heaven. Carter reminds me of Wisconsins Aaron Henry (a former CB), I believe if paired with an improved front 7 and a physical, solid tackling SS, Carter would do well. I believe he will be in the FS rotation. I don't see Carter as soft, he just needs to get out of his own way.

Cedric Thompson? Great speed and willing tackler. Like Carter, I believe he will be in the FS rotation.

James Manuel? Make or break year/career for him. He will be given every opportunity to win the starting SS position....and then some. Guys who look like him always are. He won't keep it....he is not a S. Folks, one of the hardest things to do is tackle a ball carrier in all that space. He should be begging to play lb. Can you say WWF!

Kenny Watkins? Nobody mentions him but they should. The question is will he be given an opportunity? On every football team guys who can play are bypassed to balance the classes. I hope this doesn't happen to him.

Remember, this is purely blind speculation (no inside information).

 

[KoolAid]

Great points. Here is my two cents.

Total excluding the Juco's because we have no idea what we are getting.

Carter to safety? I don't think he would be much different than the rest of the S's in the conference. If he or anyone else is asked to do what Kim, Shady and Lewis were last season. it won't matter. This team will suck to high heaven. Carter reminds me of Wisconsins Aaron Henry (a former CB), I believe if paired with an improved front 7 and a physical, solid tackling SS, Carter would do well. I believe he will be in the FS rotation. I don't see Carter as soft, he just needs to get out of his own way.

Cedric Thompson? Great speed and willing tackler. Like Carter, I believe he will be in the FS rotation.

James Manuel? Make or break year/career for him. He will be given every opportunity to win the starting SS position....and then some. Guys who look like him always are. He won't keep it....he is not a S. Folks, one of the hardest things to do is tackle a ball carrier in all that space. He should be begging to play lb. Can you say WWF!

Kenny Watkins? Nobody mentions him but they should. The question is will he be given an opportunity? On every football team guys who can play are bypassed to balance the classes. I hope this doesn't happen to him.

Remember, this is purely blind speculation (no inside information).

That's good stuff right there. Glad to hear it's Manuel's position to lose and I'm hoping you're wrong about him losing it.

 

[Bob_Loblaw]

Great points. Here is my two cents.

Total excluding the Juco's because we have no idea what we are getting.

Carter to safety? I don't think he would be much different than the rest of the S's in the conference. If he or anyone else is asked to do what Kim, Shady and Lewis were last season. it won't matter. This team will suck to high heaven. Carter reminds me of Wisconsins Aaron Henry (a former CB), I believe if paired with an improved front 7 and a physical, solid tackling SS, Carter would do well. I believe he will be in the FS rotation. I don't see Carter as soft, he just needs to get out of his own way.

Cedric Thompson? Great speed and willing tackler. Like Carter, I believe he will be in the FS rotation.

James Manuel? Make or break year/career for him. He will be given every opportunity to win the starting SS position....and then some. Guys who look like him always are. He won't keep it....he is not a S. Folks, one of the hardest things to do is tackle a ball carrier in all that space. He should be begging to play lb. Can you say WWF!

Kenny Watkins? Nobody mentions him but they should. The question is will he be given an opportunity? On every football team guys who can play are bypassed to balance the classes. I hope this doesn't happen to him.

Remember, this is purely blind speculation (no inside information).

Great points!

I shouldn't have used the word "soft" to describe Carter, I don't think his strength is his physicality. I've always thought Carter excelled when he was given a guy to cover, man-to-man, and stick with him. I thought Carter often looked lost in zone coverage and he wasn't the surest tackler. I just think moving Carter to FS would be minimizing his strengths and asking him to do things that he had struggled. I hope Michael Carter plays a lot, but the prospect of playing him 10 yards away from a WR and asking him to read, react and tackle isn't putting him in the best spot to succeed.

Cedric Thompson, I agree with you. If we had more depth, i'd like Cedric at SS. He's a bit undersized but he's a good tackler in space and fast. We'll see how good he is in coverage.

Manuel....I agree with you. Manuel seems like a S playing SS. He reminds me of what I think K. Cooper would look like as a SS ( a great athlete playing out of position). I think Manuel could be a considerably better OLB than SS. He might have improved over the last couple years, but in my opinion, if he's asked to be in coverage too much it won't be pretty.

Watkins is interesting. He has always looked good at spring games and I've always been waiting for him to emerge. I was surprised that he saw virtually no playing time (outside of special teams), so I sort of forgot about him. If he can come in and play, that would help a lot.

I also have this weird feeling that D. Wright might end up at S. I don't know if he'd be at all capable of playing right away. However, I just think that the RB position is starting to fill up (Gillum, Kirkwood, Cobb, possibly Banham) and watching the kid last year on special teams, he was fast and really didn't shy away from contact.

 

[MNVCGUY]

I think what this discussion proves is that this will be a very interesting area to watch during spring ball. You have to think the coaches expect the JC guys to be in the mix because you don't recruit JC guys with the idea of having them ride the bench, you bring them in to play and play right away. Track records show that at least a few JC guys are not going to pan out but you have to figure at least one of them ends up in the mix next season.

The good news is there are a number of options for the coaches to look at the bad news is there are not really any sure things maybe outside of TS now that he has been granted the extra year.

Hopefully over the course of spring ball, fall camp, and maybe even a few non-conference games the coaches will be able to find a rotation that can compete in the Big Ten. I really hope that this is the year guys like Carter and Manuel finally live up to expectations.

 

[mnsports1]

Great points. Here is my two cents.

Total excluding the Juco's because we have no idea what we are getting.

Carter to safety? I don't think he would be much different than the rest of the S's in the conference. If he or anyone else is asked to do what Kim, Shady and Lewis were last season. it won't matter. This team will suck to high heaven. Carter reminds me of Wisconsins Aaron Henry (a former CB), I believe if paired with an improved front 7 and a physical, solid tackling SS, Carter would do well. I believe he will be in the FS rotation. I don't see Carter as soft, he just needs to get out of his own way.

Cedric Thompson? Great speed and willing tackler. Like Carter, I believe he will be in the FS rotation.

James Manuel? Make or break year/career for him. He will be given every opportunity to win the starting SS position....and then some. Guys who look like him always are. He won't keep it....he is not a S. Folks, one of the hardest things to do is tackle a ball carrier in all that space. He should be begging to play lb. Can you say WWF!

Kenny Watkins? Nobody mentions him but they should. The question is will he be given an opportunity? On every football team guys who can play are bypassed to balance the classes. I hope this doesn't happen to him.

Remember, this is purely blind speculation (no inside information).

You don't sound like much of a fan of this coaching staff. Is it because you didn't think their D helped Kim's draft status?
By the way, I am a fan of Kim coming home to play and I hope he catches on in the NFL.

 

[Sportsfan24]

You don't sound like much of a fan of this coaching staff. Is it because you didn't think their D helped Kim's draft status?
By the way, I am a fan of Kim coming home to play and I hope he catches on in the NFL.

Thanks for the kind words.

My thoughts on the coaching staff? Look; I liked Tim Brewster. Tim is a buddy, (I just spoke to him the other day.) However, I can honestly say that I believe Jerry can and will turn this program. He knows exactly what he is doing. And, signing day is just around the corner.

The defensive scheme? They tried to make chicken salad out of chicken bleep. I'm sure THEY didn't want to run some of the schemes they did; they didn't have any choice. If you can't stop the run with your front 7, you have to bring guys up in the box. Your choice is dying a slow death (the run) or a fast death (pass). The fact that it wasn't a fast death most of the time speaks directly to the ability of those corners that everyone wants to trash all the time.

If you can't rush the passer with your front 7, you have to generate pressure blitzing lb's and db's. Again, this creates an incredible amount of pressure on the secondary and D in general. The short answer is they ran the defensive schemes they had too.

I'm also sure that we will never...ever never...never ever never, try to go one on one with a future NFL 1st round wr, being thrown too by a future NFL 1st rd QB, whose left tackle is a future NFL 1st rd LT.

Kim? He changed positions to his detriment and to the benefit of the team (wouldn't have it any other way.) Instead of looking at him as a former corner who is a pass covering FS, who is also one of the best (if not the best) tackling db/defensive players in the country (2nd in the Big Ten and 16th in the country.) Instead he is being type cast (incorrectly) as a run stuffing SS (not what you want when you are 5'10 and 200lbs.) who must suck (not be very good) because his team sucked (wasn't very good.) Meanwhile inferior players (not just speaking stats) were invited to all-star games and the combine because they were on more successful teams (to the victors go the spoils.)

It didn't need to be this hard but the NFL thing will work itself out; creme always rises the top. (Note: it's easy to heap praise on god when everything goes great; can you still glorify him during times of adversity?.....or as the great philosophers New Edition once said "everybody loves sunshine; tell me, can you stand the rain?")

I know I should pretend it doesn't bother me but that would be deceitful and let's be real...some of you may be smart enough not to admit to it, but you would be THINKING the same way!

 

[zambam]

If you can't rush the passer with your front 7, you have to generate pressure blitzing lb's and db's. Again, this creates an incredible amount of pressure on the secondary and D in general. The short answer is they ran the defensive schemes they had too.

Just thought I'd point out, LB's are a part of the front 7.

 

[Bob_Loblaw]

Just thought I'd point out, LB's are a part of the front 7.

I think he meant that we not only had to bring players from our front 7 (including LBs) but also DBs. If you noticed, a great deal of our pressure packages included a DB.

 

[zambam]

I think he meant that we not only had to bring players from our front 7 (including LBs) but also DBs. If you noticed, a great deal of our pressure packages included a DB.

I did notice that, and when I reread it thinking that way you're probably right.

 

[Nate]

Thanks for continuing to post here even though Kim has moved on. I enjoy reading your posts and insights.

Best of luck to him and the rest of your family.

 

[mnsports1]

Thanks for the kind words.

My thoughts on the coaching staff? Look; I liked Tim Brewster. Tim is a buddy, (I just spoke to him the other day.) However, I can honestly say that I believe Jerry can and will turn this program. He knows exactly what he is doing. And, signing day is just around the corner.

The defensive scheme? They tried to make chicken salad out of chicken bleep. I'm sure THEY didn't want to run some of the schemes they did; they didn't have any choice. If you can't stop the run with your front 7, you have to bring guys up in the box. Your choice is dying a slow death (the run) or a fast death (pass). The fact that it wasn't a fast death most of the time speaks directly to the ability of those corners that everyone wants to trash all the time.

If you can't rush the passer with your front 7, you have to generate pressure blitzing lb's and db's. Again, this creates an incredible amount of pressure on the secondary and D in general. The short answer is they ran the defensive schemes they had too.

I'm also sure that we will never...ever never...never ever never, try to go one on one with a future NFL 1st round wr, being thrown too by a future NFL 1st rd QB, whose left tackle is a future NFL 1st rd LT.

Kim? He changed positions to his detriment and to the benefit of the team (wouldn't have it any other way.) Instead of looking at him as a former corner who is a pass covering FS, who is also one of the best (if not the best) tackling db/defensive players in the country (2nd in the Big Ten and 16th in the country.) Instead he is being type cast (incorrectly) as a run stuffing SS (not what you want when you are 5'10 and 200lbs.) who must suck (not be very good) because his team sucked (wasn't very good.) Meanwhile inferior players (not just speaking stats) were invited to all-star games and the combine because they were on more successful teams (to the victors go the spoils.)

It didn't need to be this hard but the NFL thing will work itself out; creme always rises the top. (Note: it's easy to heap praise on god when everything goes great; can you still glorify him during times of adversity?.....or as the great philosophers New Edition once said "everybody loves sunshine; tell me, can you stand the rain?")

I know I should pretend it doesn't bother me but that would be deceitful and let's be real...some of you may be smart enough not to admit to it, but you would be THINKING the same way!

Thanks for your thoughts, I look forward to them due to the different perspective you are able to offer. The comments about "if you believe him" regarding coach Kill and his comments on GPA just got me wondering what you thoughts on the staff were. That just sounded personal and not football related.

Kim may not get the big front money due to the change etc., but coaches want players so I bet he gets his shot.