How bad was that call on Botticelli?

[Replacement Gopher]

My eyeball burst when we blew That Michigan Game.

I don't know what will happen if a call like the Botticelli call goes against us next week impacts the game.

Will likely end up in jail or hospital or both.
Actually, come to think of it, that might happen if we win too.

Oh man, I gotta get some things in order before Sat.

 

[bleedsmaroonandgold]

That call was insane. Sometimes, as fans, we get frustrated because after seeing a different angle on a call we realize our thoughts are confirmed and the ref probably got it wrong. This was not one of those times. That was a horrendous call from any angle, and I have no idea what on earth the ref could have been looking at. How can a paid professional get it that wrong?

 

[Cayman]

Posters on the game thread on buckyville even thought it was an awful call.

 

[Pompous Elitist]

I think you'll find many here that agree with calls against us but don't mind the bad/no calls. It's that Minnesota nice thing.

 

[DoubleAlum]

My eyeball burst when we blew That Michigan Game.

I don't know what will happen if a call like the Botticelli call goes against us next week impacts the game.

Will likely end up in jail or hospital or both.
Actually, come to think of it, that might happen if we win too.

Oh man, I gotta get some things in order before Sat.

Post of the Day!!

 

[DoubleAlum]

Posters on the game thread on buckyville even thought it was an awful call.

Posters on Nebraska's board thought it was an awful call too!

 

[DoubleAlum]

My eyeball burst when we blew That Michigan Game.

I don't know what will happen if a call like the Botticelli call goes against us next week impacts the game.

Will likely end up in jail or hospital or both.
Actually, come to think of it, that might happen if we win too.

Oh man, I gotta get some things in order before Sat.

That was the worst call I think I've ever seen. I just can't understand what's happening. Last night my wife and I watched a movie on NetFlix. We watched the 30 for 30 on the Boston College point shaving scandal. Michael Bowie, a player on that team who was wrongly implicated, observed inexplicable things happening on the court during the season and questioned his teammates about them. In other words, he trusted his eyes and knew that something didn't seem right. Trust your eyes here fellas. That call was as bizarre as your eyes are telling you. Something isn't right out there. Maybe some day we'll find out.

 

[MNVCGUY]

Posters on Nebraska's board thought it was an awful call too!

It was absolutely a bad call, one of a couple in the game. The only thing I take issue with (and so far that has not been done in this thread) is when fans think the bad calls are part of some bigger plan to screw over the Gophers. Refs have a really hard job and they absolutely make bad calls in nearly any game you watch but there is an attitude around here about the officials being out to get us that gets really tiresome.

 

[cncmin]

Posters on Nebraska's board thought it was an awful call too!

They were complaining because if they won, it was just another reason to keep Pelini around longer. If you read their game post, it's amazing how many of them, by the end of that game, were cheering against their own team. Though admittedly, it was really difficult to tell how serious they were. Entertaining thread, for sure.

 

[MNVCGUY]

That was the worst call I think I've ever seen. I just can't understand what's happening. Last night my wife and I watched a movie on NetFlix. We watched the 30 for 30 on the Boston College point shaving scandal. Michael Bowie, a player on that team who was wrongly implicated, observed inexplicable things happening on the court during the season and questioned his teammates about them. In other words, he trusted his eyes and knew that something didn't seem right. Trust your eyes here fellas. That call was as bizarre as your eyes are telling you. Something isn't right out there. Maybe some day we'll find out.

Spoke too soon.....so in your opinion then the ref was intentionally trying to cause Nebraska to win?

 

[DoubleAlum]

They were complaining because if they won, it was just another reason to keep Pelini around longer. If you read their game post, it's amazing how many of them, by the end of that game, were cheering against their own team. Though admittedly, it was really difficult to tell how serious they were. Entertaining thread, for sure.

I understood their Pelini position very well. But their initial, knee-jerk reaction was disbelief that the call was made. Even the announcers thought it was ridiculous.

 

[DoubleAlum]

Spoke too soon.....so in your opinion then the ref was intentionally trying to cause Nebraska to win?

That's a fair question. I'm not really sure what was going on. I'm not a very clever guy and don't understand the betting world, etc. All I believe is that if 100 refs observed that call, not one would've called roughing the passer. Who knows, maybe I'm crazy. Maybe in "real time" it looks a lot different.

 

[station19]

Spoke too soon.....so in your opinion then the ref was intentionally trying to cause Nebraska to win?

It's those bums that replaced me.

 

[cncmin]

That was the worst call I think I've ever seen. I just can't understand what's happening. Last night my wife and I watched a movie on NetFlix. We watched the 30 for 30 on the Boston College point shaving scandal. Michael Bowie, a player on that team who was wrongly implicated, observed inexplicable things happening on the court during the season and questioned his teammates about them. In other words, he trusted his eyes and knew that something didn't seem right. Trust your eyes here fellas. That call was as bizarre as your eyes are telling you. Something isn't right out there. Maybe some day we'll find out.

You mean like the TWolves vs. Lakers Western Conference Championship, where the Wolves were called for a slew of completely phantom fouls to send guys like Kobe Bryant to the line to help the Lakers end up in the NBA championship - and we find out years later that the NBA fix actually was true? (Side-note: I stopped watching the NBA after that series)

One could have a pretty good argument about the Vikes/Brett Favre / NO Aints game a few years post-Katrina too; not only were the refs blowing calls all over the field in the Aints' favor late in that game, but we found out afterwards that the Aints' coaching staff WAS having its players intentionally try to hurt Favre, just like it appeared to us watching the game in real time. How bad was the reffing to send NO to the Super Bowl? The NFL implemented the "Brett Fare Rule" before the next season to ensure that refs couldn't simply hand a team an OT victory by giving them ~40 free yards to set up a GW FG attempt w/o actually moving the ball for a first down on their own - the other team would at least have a chance to have a counter-possession to overcome the tragedy.

As for yesterday, there are a couple reasons why I think that call was actually just an unintentionally missed call: (1) other official(s) came over to discuss it. If there was a "fix", I doubt there would have been a discussion. (2a) Two other calls, as well: previous to that drive, the whistle blew while Leidner was being held up by the D in an attempt to strip the ball. The play was clearly over; however, the official did not have to blow his whistle to stop play, it's a judgment call. Not only did the official blow his whistle, but when Nebraska grab the ball and started running the other way, other officials stopped play immediately. (2b) On a potential big play game-winning catch just a few plays after the botched Botticelli call, the official correctly flagged the WR for running out of bounds. Again, if the "fix" is in, the official turns the other way and lets that go.

There have been many games that it felt like the "fix" was in against the Gophers. I didn't feel that way this time, though. Keep in mind that Botticelli DID hit Armstrong in the legs. The ignored part was why that happened (blocked/tackled down in front of the QB) and how hard of a hit (pretty soft). Still, my point is that it was a bad call, but it was at least partially excusable. Many many many worse calls against the Gophers over the years.

 

[Replacement Gopher]

Next weeks refs: you're on notice!

 

[Replacement Gopher]

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[Mulligan]

Made worse when they stood around and discussed it a while.

 

[DoubleAlum]

Spoke too soon.....so in your opinion then the ref was intentionally trying to cause Nebraska to win?

MNVCGUY, I can't believe that I've gotten to this point in life, but at age 53, in the year 2014, I think I've noticed that truth, honesty, integrity, etc. is no longer a valued virtue in our society. People are crooked at every level of society. From rummaging through our mailboxes, to ripping Visa charge machines off the counter, to rampant fraud on Wall Street, to internet fraud, to identity theft, to politicians falling like flies amid scandals, to Roger Goodell, to USOC Swimming Rape, to Bill Cosby, to the priests cover ups, to cover ups at the Vatican, to WMD, to SEC/ESPN, to Bernie Maddoff, to whistleblowers getting railroaded all over our country, to the malicious bullying in society where not even school principals will intervene and help. We could go on and on. I admire positive people in the world who can look beyond this and give everyone the benefit of the doubt. But, I hope you'll agree that it takes doubters and suspicious people to uncover a lot of this stuff. If everyone were positive and optimistic about everything, lots of this stuff would still be going on.

I have no idea what could be going on inside the "boardrooms" of major collegiate sports. But, given everything you've witnessed in our society in your time on this earth, do you think it's still far-fetched to believe that something crooked may be happening?

 

[Winnipegopher]

No one has brought up that they picked up a flag earlier in the game when Myrick dropped the kickoff. The other Gopher (BBC?) got it and then got thumped on the ground late by a Nebraska player. The refs discussed and then pulled the flag and said the player "was in the air" prior to the recovery.

If that one got picked up, and I think it was ok to pick it up, Botticelli's flag should have been picked up as well.

 

[bkrownd]

MNVCGUY, I can't believe that I've gotten to this point in life, but at age 53, in the year 2014, I think I've noticed that truth, honesty, integrity, etc. is no longer a valued virtue in our society. People are crooked at every level of society.

Old guy is really old.

 

[MNVCGUY]

That's a fair question. I'm not really sure what was going on. I'm not a very clever guy and don't understand the betting world, etc. All I believe is that if 100 refs observed that call, not one would've called roughing the passer. Who knows, maybe I'm crazy. Maybe in "real time" it looks a lot different.

That last part is 100% the part I think a lot of fans don't take into account while watching countless slow mo replays from multiple different angles. Who knows exactly what the ref saw in real time, but he called what he saw. He was wrong but none of us have any way of knowing exactly what it looked like to him at the time of the play.

I am not naive to think that behind the scenes stuff doesn't happen but I also don't immediately jump to that conclusion. Especially in a game like this one where there really would be no reason for the conference to try and fix the game for Nebraska. For the most part I am willing to give refs the benefit of the doubt that they are doing the best they can. It is an extremely tough job and any bad call gets blown way out of proportion and the good calls are totally ignored. There is a reason that the youth levels are struggling to find refs, it is because many are deciding it just isn't worth being questioned and yelled at anytime they make a mistake. Until we hit the point where we remove the human element from the game we have to leave some understanding for the fact that they just might make a mistake with no evil intent behind it.

 

[Pompous Elitist]

A few thoughts

- I generally never assume malice where incompetence is equally likely
- that said, it's naive to think officials don't have their own inner biases towards certain coaches, teams, players. They are human.
- there are 7 officials on the field, all with specific assignments, with a particular attention to the "point of attack". It is difficult to explain away, for example, the mauling of Freuchte on the 3rd and long play or Richardson being tackled on the long throw to Bell. These are not always difficult calls.
- it would take only one "bad" or influenced official, or referee in particular to influence the outcome of a game. We've all seen it.

What I'd like to see is some disciplinary action for bad or missed calls. I'd like to see some heads roll every now and then to keep these guys on notice and locked in.

This has been a really, REALLY sloppy season for the officials in my opinion.

 

[GophersInIowa]

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Man, that is worse and worse every time I watch it. Not only was he blocked into the QB, he hardly hit him and even let up.

 

[MNVCGUY]

A few thoughts

- I generally never assume malice where incompetence is equally likely
- that said, it's naive to think officials don't have their own inner biases towards certain coaches, teams, players. They are human.
- there are 7 officials on the field, all with specific assignments, with a particular attention to the "point of attack". It is difficult to explain away, for example, the mauling of Freuchte on the 3rd and long play or Richardson being tackled on the long throw to Bell. These are not always difficult calls.
- it would take only one "bad" or influenced official, or referee in particular to influence the outcome of a game. We've all seen it.

What I'd like to see is some disciplinary action for bad or missed calls. I'd like to see some heads roll every now and then to keep these guys on notice and locked in.

This has been a really, REALLY sloppy season for the officials in my opinion.

I know for a fact that all officials are graded on every game and those grades determine who gets to ref in high profile or championship games. Also determines who is back the following year. They are held accountable by the league office for the calls they make and don't make and they are constantly being evaluated.

Most of us could only name maybe a couple of head officials in the league and have no clue who all the other ones on the field are for any given game. Corrections and changes are ongoing it just isn't done in the public eye.

 

[RodentRampage]

MNVCGUY, I can't believe that I've gotten to this point in life, but at age 53, in the year 2014, I think I've noticed that truth, honesty, integrity, etc. is no longer a valued virtue in our society. People are crooked at every level of society. From rummaging through our mailboxes, to ripping Visa charge machines off the counter, to rampant fraud on Wall Street, to internet fraud, to identity theft, to politicians falling like flies amid scandals, to Roger Goodell, to USOC Swimming Rape, to Bill Cosby, to the priests cover ups, to cover ups at the Vatican, to WMD, to SEC/ESPN, to Bernie Maddoff, to whistleblowers getting railroaded all over our country, to the malicious bullying in society where not even school principals will intervene and help. We could go on and on. I admire positive people in the world who can look beyond this and give everyone the benefit of the doubt. But, I hope you'll agree that it takes doubters and suspicious people to uncover a lot of this stuff. If everyone were positive and optimistic about everything, lots of this stuff would still be going on.

I have no idea what could be going on inside the "boardrooms" of major collegiate sports. But, given everything you've witnessed in our society in your time on this earth, do you think it's still far-fetched to believe that something crooked may be happening?

Society isn't any more corrupt than it has ever been. If you think it is, you really need to take a closer look at history. It is harder to get away with corruption than it used to be. It's not impossible for refs to be bought off, but without evidence, but you still need evidence, you can't simply assume that corruption is involved.

 

[MinneStoa]

Society isn't any more corrupt than it has ever been. If you think it is, you really need to take a closer look at history. It is harder to get away with corruption than it used to be. It's not impossible for refs to be bought off, but without evidence, but you still need evidence, you can't simply assume that corruption is involved.

Seriously, thank you for this. I am so sick of the "the world is going to hell, I miss the good old days" trope.

 

[highwayman]

Keep in mind that Botticelli DID hit Armstrong in the legs.

I guess if you count Armstrong's crotch as legs, you are right. Otherwise, he never touched his legs. Horrendous call no matter which way you look at it.

 

[bleedsmaroonandgold]

There is no angle or speed at which that call was excusable. The ref should be ashamed, he couldn't have screwed up worse on that play.

 

[nsmike]

I think the biggest problem with B1G officials is that there errors never seem to even out. Bad calls go against the underdog at a far higher rate than they should. It might be an unconscious bias but it's there.

 

[MNGoldenGophers1]

I guess if you count Armstrong's crotch as legs, you are right. Otherwise, he never touched his legs. Horrendous call no matter which way you look at it.

Yes. It would have made more sense to throw a flag when Mitch got pushed after running out of bounds on one play. This victory all the more impressive when you realize we were playing against 11 Cornhuskers and a handful of zebras.