At what point do you consider that "the program has been turned around"?

When has "the program been turned around?"

  • Already has been. Glen Mason did it.

    Votes: 5 5.5%

  • It was mostly turned, but the turning finished after Brewster was fired

    Votes: 4 4.4%

  • A Big Ten West title will have turned it

    Votes: 22 24.2%

  • 4-5 years of finishing at or near the top of the West turns it

    Votes: 49 53.8%

  • Winning the Big Ten turns it

    Votes: 8 8.8%

  • Winning Multiple Big Ten Titles turns it.

    Votes: 3 3.3%
  • Total voters
    91
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Dano564

Dano564

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In conversations people talk about "Things will be great if the coach can turn the program around".

What is often thought of is the dire environment of the Wacker, Salem, or Brewster days depending on when you starting become a fan.

So for the masses, at what point is the "program turned around".

Please vote
 



I think it has been turned around...now. We are a top 10 team nationally and taken seriously. The comprehensive talent level on both sides of the ball on this team is something we haven't seen in my 20 years of going to Gopher football games.

Is there more to accomplish? Of course, but the future looks bright.
 

Of those choices 4-5 years of sustained success was what I went with.

That said, there is a very definite shift in the program that started late last season and has carried over through this year. Don't think things are fully turned around but they are on a different trajectory then what has been the case around here for a long time.

If 2020 is similar to or better then what has happened this year I think it will be safe to say the program has fully turned the corner from being an also ran into a contender. I feel very confident that is the direction we are heading in.
 


Having 8-9 win seasons consistently mixing in a 6-6 as the really bad years and 10+ in the really good years.

No reason we can't win the west a few times a decade.
 

for those voting that there needs to be 4-5 years finishing at or near the top of the big 10 west, this season marks the third time in the past 6 seasons the Gophers have been close to winning the B1G West. So, I guess we're pretty close?
 

I find this thread funny. Turned around from when? Mason turned it around, Kill turned it around. Fleck is taking it to unprecedented levels in the modern era, if you can call the 1970's and forward the modern era (last half century)! So I guess if you want to say "turned around" you are referring to turning it around from 50 years ago.

With that being said, I'll say a 10 win+ season followed by at least 2 more seasons of 9 to 10 wins out of the next 3.
 

to me, "turned around" suggests a significant change in direction. Gophers were 1-11 in 2007. After that, it was several years of just above or below .500. then Kill had back-to-back 8 win seasons, followed by a slightly down year, then a 9-win season. So, I would say that by the 9-win season under Claeys, the program had been "turned around" from a negative direction to a positive direction.

Under Fleck, the program is continuing to move in a positive direction - only going faster and farther. so, I submit this is not a new direction under Fleck - but he is improving on what his predecessors did. Like a company that goes into the red, then starts turning a profit. then, they hire a new CEO and the profits go up faster and higher. Same direction, but more significant results.
 



Some Day...Maybe said:
I find this thread funny. Turned around from when? Mason turned it around, Kill turned it around. Fleck is taking it to unprecedented levels in the modern era, if you can call the 1970's and forward the modern era (last half century)! So I guess if you want to say "turned around" you are referring to turning it around from 50 years ago.

With that being said, I'll say a 10 win+ season followed by at least 2 more seasons of 9 to 10 wins out of the next 3.
Click to expand...

I saw someone else say something to the effect of "if we can turn things around here".
It confused me a bit because part of my thought is Mason turned it around.
Brewster appears to be a blip.

But if things weren't turned around by Mason, we have to be pretty close to turning it around now. But it appears it may take several years of high success for some to consider it turned.
 

Well I would say Kill and Claeys already did "turn the program around" from the Brewster days as they got us to that 8-9 win total 3 out of their last 4 years and a bowl game their last 5 years.

But in terms of taking "the next step," I would say that entails an 11 win season and New Year's 6 bowl.
 

Some Day...Maybe said:
I find this thread funny. Turned around from when? Mason turned it around, Kill turned it around. Fleck is taking it to unprecedented levels in the modern era, if you can call the 1970's and forward the modern era (last half century)! So I guess if you want to say "turned around" you are referring to turning it around from 50 years ago.

With that being said, I'll say a 10 win+ season followed by at least 2 more seasons of 9 to 10 wins out of the next 3.
Click to expand...
I agree, I think Mason was the one who turned it around, then Brewster put us on a trajectory to being not so good. Kill and Claeys got it going in the right direction again and PJ has continued that and taken us to a new level of success this year.
If you think back to the picture below, PJ had it about right if the start of his graph is at the end of Mason.
fleck.jpg
 

GFBfan said:
I agree, I think Mason was the one who turned it around, then Brewster put us on a trajectory to being not so good. Kill and Claeys got it going in the right direction again and PJ has continued that and taken us to a new level of success this year.
If you think back to the picture below, PJ had it about right if the start of his graph is at the end of Mason.
View attachment 6546
Click to expand...
This chart appears to be extremely accurate (although not to scale).
 



I don't know. We are doing well this year and things are looking up. Keep that up for a few years I guess.
 


GFBfan said:
I agree, I think Mason was the one who turned it around, then Brewster put us on a trajectory to being not so good. Kill and Claeys got it going in the right direction again and PJ has continued that and taken us to a new level of success this year.
If you think back to the picture below, PJ had it about right if the start of his graph is at the end of Mason.
View attachment 6546
Click to expand...
Was just having a conversation with a friend about this before the basketball game last night. I'm totally with you: the biggest seismic shift in this program was due to Glen Mason. Before him, the program was a joke going all the way back to Gutekunst. Mason dragged it and Joel Maturi kicking and screaming into being big-time, the biggest move being the construction of TCF Bank Stadium. That wouldn't have happened quite the same way without Glen, and although Joel did a creditable job of managing and fundraising it, he did so reluctantly, and there's no way it would have happened nearly as well or as soon had it not been for Mason. It remains a shame that he didn't get to coach there.

Maturi tried his darndest to retard the program for the sake of his beloved Badgers, most notably by hiring Brewster--and then promising his neck was on the line with the hire but never intending to actually be accountable for it. Fortunately, the transformation of the program to big-time status wasn't permanently incapacitated by Brewster, and Kill was able to regain momentum and get the thing out of the mud and further down the road.

If I would ever see Glen anywhere, I'd tell him what I said above and thank him for what he did. I've never denied that the guy wasn't perfect or didn't have his warts, but he put his all into this, and the difference between before him and after him is the difference between a caterpillar and a butterfly. When he talks about the Gophs on BTN, you can feel the satisfaction of knowing his prominent role in the program's renewal and his love for the school and the city.
 

Reading some of the comments makes me want to change my vote because I agree that if we are just talking about turning the program around, Mason already did that. He took a program that was a joke and made it respectable again. Brewster undid some of that but Kill/Claeys restored it.

I guess the more relevant question would be when do you think the program will have moved from also ran to contender? That is where the 4-5 years of sustained success near the top of the division comes into play. Not just a one year blip but year in year out being looked at as a team that could win the West in the way that Iowa and Wisconsin are most years.
 

Perhaps it has already been turned around, but the program hasn’t ‘made it’ until winning at least the West Division.
 

Certainly finishing a season ranked is a prerequisite. Regularly being in the preseason discussion about possible conference champs in a capacity other than an "underdog to keep an eye on" would be my other metric.
 

This may sound crazy, but if they get 5 or more conference wins next year with that schedule- that would be huge.
 

I voted Mason because he did most of the "turning" after the dumpster fire that was here before that. The feeling that the team could compete with anyone changed dramatically from 1997 to 1999. That said, I think there are two different stages of "turning around" the program.

-Mason brought the program back to respectability and was a cat's whisker from a BG10 title a couple times. Kill/Claeys continued in that mold but never got quite as close as 1999 or 2003.
-Fleck is already as close as Mason was to getting to the next level of expecting to be in championship contention routinely, but time will tell.
 

Some Day...Maybe said:
I find this thread funny. Turned around from when? Mason turned it around, Kill turned it around. Fleck is taking it to unprecedented levels in the modern era, if you can call the 1970's and forward the modern era (last half century)! So I guess if you want to say "turned around" you are referring to turning it around from 50 years ago.

With that being said, I'll say a 10 win+ season followed by at least 2 more seasons of 9 to 10 wins out of the next 3.
Click to expand...

So, just for discussion sake, who takes all those losses in the West? If we win the West three times out of ten, who wins the other seven? For example, if the Badgers win three that means there are only four wins left for Iowa, Nebraska, Northwestern, Purdue and Illinois left to share. Somebody is sure going to be PO'd of that lot. I agree with you, I'm just pointing out why the Badger and Hawkeye trolls were always so afraid of Fleck: if we do well they can not do as well as what they have become used to. Not to mention the others.
 

Veritas said:
So, just for discussion sake, who takes all those losses in the West? If we win the West three times out of ten, who wins the other seven? For example, if the Badgers win three that means there are only four wins left for Iowa, Nebraska, Northwestern, Purdue and Illinois left to share. Somebody is sure going to be PO'd of that lot. I agree with you, I'm just pointing out why the Badger and Hawkeye trolls were always so afraid of Fleck: if we do well they can not do as well as what they have become used to. Not to mention the others.
Click to expand...

The Badgers would lose out as the dominant team. Wisconsin is the only current West team to have multiple divisional or conference titles in the past decade. Iowa, Northwestern and Nebraska each have one divisional title.
 

Mase got the stadium built. His Big Ten winning percentage was .400 and some years above. He won some border battles and started getting some bowl wins. Any GOPHER football coach with a tenure at Minnesota of .400 and above is in an elite class. Since 1972, the list of .400 plus Big Ten winning coaches includes Stoll, Holtz, Mason and Kill/TC. (Gutey was .396 and a day late and a dollar short...)

My mark for a TURN/ARRIVAL point is a tenure at Minnesota in BT play tha reaches/surpasses .500 and that means Murray Warmath is the benchmark for the past 65 years. Only Murray was above .500 BT for his tenure at Minnesota.

I have started a watch for Coach Fleck to hit that lofty .500 BT winning percentage mark for the first time. Should he experience that rare air, the trick will be to maintain at that level or above. Pretty exciting. 8 plus BT win seasons help make a coach a Legend.
The day before the Northwestern game, Coach Fleck is 11-14 or .444 in BT play here at Minnesota. He certainly has positioned himself well. Beat the stinking cat, GOPHER!
 

Panthadad2,
And I'm thinking that is what the game in eight days will really be all about. Who will be the dominant team in the West in the future, the new guys or the old guys.
 

Bad Gopher said:
and although Joel did a creditable job of managing and fundraising it, he did so reluctantly
Click to expand...

Give me a break. After Maturi was hired, like most new bosses, he had the department establish their mission, vision and values. Even brought in outside people to guide the department through the process. When it was finished, their vision consisted of five goals....four of them were the generic crap (compete for titles, don't cheat, etc.), but the fifth was specific....Bring Football Back to Campus. Could have easily been....Find a New Home for Gopher Football (keeping hope alive of Viking partnership). Maturi was all in.

ADs make bad hires. He followed it with someone who got MN to a NYD bowl.
 

I clicked on 4-5 years, but that isn't my answer. Basically whenever it is we prove we aren't a one hit wonder. Is it next year? 2 years? I don't know.
 

Another great indicator is getting 5-Star recruits. If Gophers can sign 1-2 5-star recruits every year....that my friends shows that the program has turned!
 


year of the gopher said:
I think it has been turned around...now. We are a top 10 team nationally and taken seriously. The comprehensive talent level on both sides of the ball on this team is something we haven't seen in my 20 years of going to Gopher football games.

Is there more to accomplish? Of course, but the future looks bright.
Click to expand...

So if Gophs go 6-6 next year and 7-5 in 2021, have they?
 

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